OK, because there are very often the same remarks on several topics on this boards, like the last ones for example :
May I ask why you didn't just order a "bullet-proofed" (refurbished) original Ms. Pac-man PCB off US eBay? It would've had the original intro screen with the 1980 Midway Mfg. logo AND it would've been half the price you paid. Also, since you're not using the Galaga game, you paid a premium for it needlessly. You also could've purchased to Pac to Jamma adapter.
or
Why not a 48 in 1 Bruno ? Much cheaper, plays the original game code and not the "almost but not quite the same" on that Namco board, which is still emulation too.
Seriously, you had a couple of bad experiences with boards. Either I've been very lucky or you have been very unlucky, since my boards run 100% reliable. Galaxian, Mario Bros, Missile Command, Centipede (true, after 3 parts repaired) SW (OK, in all honesty I've had to replace 2 VG-Rams on that, but it's SO easy)....
I hope one day you realise that no restoration is truly complete without the original board in it.
I understand why you do it though, and there ARE good alternatives (like Jrok's multi-williams which is NOT emulation).
And I say this with a ton of respect for all the fabulous work you do on all your cabinets, please let that be clear !!!!!
But you know......emulation.....it's nice and stuff, but in the end it feels like sex with a condom.........
let’s create a dedicated topic for this question : original boards vs re edition boards vs boot vs fan made boards, vs emulation vs 48in1 boards…vs nothing…
Of course, strictly speaking about collecting ‘original’ stuff, the ‘original’ board wins without any question.
Now let’s see what are the different type of … let’s says “collectors” ? It’s just few example, feel free to add others example.
- Some of us have only one of few cabinets, and their hobby is to restore them 100% original, without changing anything. They don’t mind to wait several weeks/months/years before reaching their goal…but it must be 100% original. They don’t have a dedicated game room, and it’s not a big problem to have a non working games for a long time. They don’t plan to play the games like a crazy… the most important thing for them : It must be ALL original or they won’t go further…this is the general definition of a collector of ‘original’ things.
- Some of us have only one or few cabinets, and they really want to play these games (because these games are the favorite one). They don’t have time/money/skill for repairing the original boards, and they must find an alternative… mame, X in 1, so t
- Some of us have a LOT of games (more than 30 or 40 cabinets)
A variation here :
* They are Living in USA :
The old ‘classic’ games are very cheap and very easy to find. The boards are easy to find, a lot of operators are still repairing these games. Warehouse are common. In addition, the US ‘Vintage Arcade Scene’ is big, deals are easy to do and very smooth…
* They are Living in Europe:
… where the old classic game are very hard to find, expensive, where the arcade community is smallest (but thanks to Internet, we are ‘almost’ together now. I’m very happy to have US friends here). Most of items (boards, parts) have to be imported… still much money … free space is a big problem in Europe. Some of us have access to a warehouse or garage, and can let non working games for a long … long time …. but others can’t have so many ‘non working’ games in their house or in their game room (the famous ‘WAF’ factor)…
Now the questions regarding … ‘the original board’:
Do Am I able to repair an original board? Where to find the components? How much money I want to spend for repair it? How much free time I have to spend in this? Do I have time to let that cabinet ‘non working’ inside my house/warehouse/game room?
What is the final objective in this?
- I’m a die hard ‘collector’… nothing except original stuff, even if it’ll take ages
- I’m a die hard ‘fan of the game’… of course I’m looking for original stuff, but they are alternatives, that won’t affect the game play or rendering of the game !
For example, using an Advance Mame setup, outputting the game on a RGB display, and with a configuration 1:1 in terms of game play, ratio/refresh of the game, exact controls, etc or using new *official* edition of the boards, such the Namco Reunion boards … no one will see any difference: same game play, same feeling, same display on the screen … IMPOSSIBLE to see or feel any difference when playing of it !
Of course, it’s not the old board behind the game, but my objective is to make the game playable EXACTLY like it supposed to be in the past, inside a restored cabinet (the aesthetic part is VERY important to me!) … and I can tell you my objectives are reached !
I’m very proud to present my games to friends, colleges, kids, games lovers (for real on via pictures on Internet), and for all the visitors and let them play on them. They don’t care if it’s the original board or not. But because I respect all these games… and the players, I’m doing all I can in order to present the games *ARCADE ACCURATE* … same game play, controls, display, sounds … the 1:1 pixel perfect experience… like it was, back in the Days.
In order to make happy the hardcore collectors, I keep all the original parts, and the modifications done are reversible.
So if one day, the GOD of arcade arrives on Earth and asks me : “What are you doing?”, I’ll tell him : “ok, let’s put back the originals parts… Here they are!”
Let me tell you something else : All the visitors/players or ‘classics games’ fans are really happy after spending some time in my game room. They played on these old games like they did 10,20,25 or 30 years ago ! I mean the chances for them to see somewhere these games up & running are so small, even almost null
I can tell you they are more happy to play the games even without the original board than to see a cabinet original but … non working! And for the 'curious' players, I can even show them the real boards ;-) Of course, there will always few people to complain… it’s live… but they represent 0.001% of the community. I respect them of course, but our objectives are not exactly the same I would say.
In addition, I’m not afraid to show ALL I’m doing on my games… as you can see, ALL my projects are showed here… sometime it takes few weeks, or months, and even YEARS but they are ALL here, with a start… a work in progress ... and for most of them …a happy end (or a happy end very soon) ! I would be curious to see what some of these hardcore collectors are really doing by the way? I invite them to post somewhere their projects or give links
It's so easy to speak... but not so easy to DO things
How many road trip I’ve already seen on other websites, with ‘non working’ games to restore… a lot of enthusiasm at the beginning and … and … nothing more on the topic … even after many months/years? What happens to these games? Probably still broken under spider webs, in the back of a garage? Waiting for a part that never will be founded or repaired? Or sold for making business ? Or the owner has no more interest in it? Hope they won’t trash it in 10 years!
I'm so happy when I see someone finally playing his favorite game, even with mame, on his authentic arcade game, than an arcade game without any live... and finally the person give up because the repair is too hard/expensive/take too much time
Maintaining a park of more than 40 ‘old’ games like I have is a real challenge and a true nightmare! It would require a full time technician with all the spare parts available& electronic knowledge to maintain the games up & running & playable. I’m not unfortunately this full time technician, so I’ve to use others techniques, like to ones you can see in some of my restorations.
What about exposing games in a Museum, where only maybe 10 on 40 games are playable just in the name of '100% original' ? What is your objectives, still the same question... We use to read 'SIZE MATTERS' on spam mails
But for this debate It would say 'Numbers matters'
Doing so many ‘experiences’ during these years allowed me to find nice tricks, like using a TV monitor via RGB for a perfect arcade display, or hacking the original Daytona controls, using the fabulous Matteo’s EURO DL conversion card (after building it) in order to use a ‘modern’ laser disc player, more reliable than the original Philips one, and still enjoy Dragon’ Lair with the real board/LD on my cabinet, creating new metal/wood or Plexiglas parts, artworks,…building a game room, than an other one… and soon an other one (Galaxian3), working on a website, …
When some modifications have to be done, always do them reversible, and keep the original parts.
Sometime, I would like to have only two or three games, and so, everything would be original… every single screws … wires … condo … you can thrust me. Once again 'Number Matters'
In conclusion, because they are different objectives, they are many solutions…
Why not a 48 in 1 Bruno ? Much cheaper, plays the original game code and not the "almost but not quite the same" on that Namco board, which is still emulation too.
No way, the emulation of the games via the 48in1 board is not accurate at all : not the same refresh rate for some games, bad sounds (pitch of the sounds is not correct), ‘title’ screens are not correct (some copyright are missing). Here’s the perfect example for you André … Galaxian … listen this (old video recording 2 years ago in order to show to the seller I'm not happy with the board, before sending back to him)
Galaxian 48in1 version video... immediately you can hear the problem
bad sound... and it's just an example...
This board is fun for someone who wants to just play the games for time to time, but not for someone who is looking for arcade accurate emulation. In addition, this board is easy to setup (jamma) and very cheap.
I also disagree regarding the Namco boards such the Namco classics 1 / 2 or the Namco Reunion board : Class of 81’
These cards are real boards, made by Namco, and reproduce exactly the games like the original versions. Of course, there is a menu for games selection, but once you're in... it's perfect
I wouldn’t call that ‘emulation’ but ‘in house reprogramming’, with maybe ‘some part of emulation’, -who knows?- but not via a reverse engineering like our favorite emulators (mame for example). Remember they are the creators of these games (PacMan, Galaga , Xevious or Ms Pac Man…), and I’m sure they have everything needed in-house for doing a good job on these modern boards. We can thrust them on that!
I don’t want to offense anyone here, but debate with all of us about our fabulous hobby : Arcade Collecting and most important thing to me : the Arcade Life Style!
There are so many people here... having their own vision of the thing : some of them are repairing everything, some of them are doing 'scratch build replica', some of them use some 'tricks', some of them are doing a little it of everything, ...
Because my English writing in not so good, I may write stupid/non-sense things here… don’t blame me / flame me! (‘sounds like a disclaimer, isn’t it?
)
Now, let’s debate...and once again, no offense
