[Restoration] Frogger - why did the frog cross the road?

[Etienne MacGyver]

Take a pic of the config you are measuring please, i think you measure continuety because of the way its connected

anyway, pic please 

[Superully]

sometimes there is an indicator at the terminals of the speakers on the "white tap" which is which
Got a pic of the speaker terminals ?

just took some pictures for you



when i looked at them at the computer, i was both surprised and shocked that + and - are indeed marked next to the terminals. the designation is there, albeit very small. man, my eyesight is getting worse! over the last few months i had to realize that i'm having difficulties reading small stuff at close range - damn!!!



one problem solved, another one remains: which wire is which? can't find the information in the schematics (however, i might just be too stupid to read it )

[Superully]

Take a pic of the config you are measuring please, i think you measure continuety because of the way its connected

your wish is my command!

here's a picture of that 6-pin connector which goes to the main board. note that i've got the feeling that some blank wires coming out of the cable on the left are touching. don't know though whether they are all from a single-colored wire or from different ones. i guess it would be a good idea to renew that connection, but then again i would have to remove the terminals from the connector and i have no replacements for them - yet ...



here's the potentiometer "on the other side"



let me tell you once again: the black wire (which is the top one at the potentiometer picture) beeps through perfectly (no matter whether i touch any other wires or not), but when i put a lead on the white wire on one side and on the red wire on the other side i get a beep as well, the same happens when i do it the other way round. the seems to be a connection between red and white (but no connection between black and red / black and white). the questions is: is there something wrong with the wiring or is it because the wires are connected to the potentiometer? perhaps i should unsolder them and repeat the test ...

[Etienne MacGyver]

Yep, unsolder them, and test again
or do the test with the potmeter totally turned to the other direction
i think your results will also twist then 

About the speaker, i knew it was on the white tab, it is there in 99,9% of the cases 

the schematics say orange and blue wires and when i folow the blue it is connected to ground, so that should be connected to the "-" terminal of the speaker

the orange goes to the "+"..

Many times this is the case (the color red is close to orange, and the color blue is close to black)
Also i would suggest to "beep" from some point on the board where is ground to see which of the two wires beeps at the other end.
that must be the ground wire then..

[Superully]

Yep, unsolder them, and test again
or do the test with the potmeter totally turned to the other direction
i think your results will also twist then 

thx etienne, everything you say sounds very logical

[level42]

+ or - normally does't matter much if you have mono (1 speaker) sound.

After all, a speaker gets AC, not DC. So there is no REAL + or -.

The only reason for them to be there is that if you have stereo set-up, you want the speakers to be in PHASE.

That means, that when you have the same sound on both speakers, both speakers will move out and in at the same time. If one would be connected reversely, one speaker would move IN and the other OUT while getting the same signal. This produces a "hollow" and strange sound.

But in mono set-up, it doesn't matter at all.

[Superully]

while trying to figure out all that wiring stuff, i had worked "secretly" () on the control panel. got one from anthony@quarterarcade and a new overlay from steven@arcadeshop



let's compare the original overlay with the reproduction part







as you can see, the colors are somewhat different, but all in all the details are there and the overlay is of high quality, so let's get the old one off!



the top layer of the old overlay comes off easily



however, this is only the thin protective layer



the rest of the overlay will have to be painstakingly removed by any means necessary



and then it's "off to the powdercoater" with the panel itself. i've decided to "go grey" this time because the overlay won't cover the panel 100% and there are some discrepancies with the pre-punched holes. this way, the slight differences won't be visible!



perfect quality - as always!



the usual cpo-installation-pictures



i'm using the heat gun to "go around the edges" more easily and to prevent the overlay from cracking in the (distant) future!



the joystick bolts in protective mimicry



moves like jagger frogger



the original player-select buttons were blue, but since that color is nowhere to be found on the overlay, i've decided to change them to yellow. not sure whether i'm going to stick with that color or not, i might try red as well to get in line with the joystick knob! for now, i like yellow though!



another piece to the puzzle is finished, i'm getting closer to the end every day now! if only that package from the usa would arrive ...

[gyruss]

don't like the yellow buttons, makes it look a bit plain imo...

[Superully]

don't like the yellow buttons, makes it look a bit plain imo...

i agree, but as i've said, i'm not 100% convinced yet either. but blue?

i'll have to try red ...

[Etienne MacGyver]

+ or - normally does't matter much if you have mono (1 speaker) sound.

After all, a speaker gets AC, not DC. So there is no REAL + or -.

The only reason for them to be there is that if you have stereo set-up, you want the speakers to be in PHASE.

That means, that when you have the same sound on both speakers, both speakers will move out and in at the same time. If one would be connected reversely, one speaker would move IN and the other OUT while getting the same signal. This produces a "hollow" and strange sound.

But in mono set-up, it doesn't matter at all.

Cool, never knew that was the reaon !
I knew that it was moving inwards instead of outwards or the other way around depending on how you connect it but not the specific reason, so another lesson learned..

Thanks for that (looking afterwards) very logic explanation !  

Thats what i like about these kind of threats on the forum, you're never too old to learn !

[Superully]

Yep, unsolder them, and test again

back from the testing board and the results are as expected: potentiometer fully working and the wires showing continuity all the way through without any discrepancies. damn, i will put everything back together again and focus on the speaker, perhaps the error can be found there. if not, it has to be a pcb issue!

[Etienne MacGyver]

Could you still repeat the test like i discribed ?
so measure again but the with the potmeter to the opposite side as it was when you measured the first time..

I am curious if my theory was right 

[Superully]

I am curious if my theory was right 

it was right!

[level42]

I don't understand why you guys seem to completely ignore Béla's posting....because I think that is the key...
I bet you'll need an external amplifier.

[Laschek]

Did you check if the onboard sound amp (should be an M51516) gets its required +12V?
Also, is -5V connected? Maybe thats needed as well, but I'm not sure if this is case for Frogger.