Dragon's Lair Fans - Arcade Lifestyle
General Chat => Technical Area => Topic started by: glstar on June 27, 2013, 09:57:02 AM
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I got this upright more than a years ago and was in not good conditions.....but with my wife and a good friend of mine i manage to have it restored (thank to Stephen of arcadefixit too, for selling me some nos items.... ;D)
This is how the cab was when i got it:
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/593/q4is.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/593/q4is.jpg/" rel="nofollow)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/27/powerdrift.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/27/powerdrift.jpg/" rel="nofollow)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/521/powerdrift2.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/521/powerdrift2.jpg/" rel="nofollow)
This is how the cab is now:
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/163/cea7.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/163/cea7.jpg/" rel="nofollow)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/109/au9p.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/109/au9p.jpg/" rel="nofollow)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/836/86mb.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/836/86mb.jpg/" rel="nofollow)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/96/gyjo.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/96/gyjo.jpg/" rel="nofollow)
But.....i've some problems with the board fitted in my Power Drift Upright machine......
I got this cab and is workign apart for two problems.....
One is that the board show some little point on screen sometimes when in play and Always on the first image where the name Power Drift is, on the edge of the words.....and sometimes (just one time until now) for example arrived at stage 3 the board block itself and i've to shutdown the cab and restart to have it work again.
Here you can clearly see the video problems....all that little White dots on the screen...
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/268/hn.JPG) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/268/hn.JPG/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/189/ncmx.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/189/ncmx.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/89/os6e.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/89/os6e.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/196/s19f.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/196/s19f.jpg/)
Second problem is that i cannot hear the audio at all.....
I was think about the power amp etc., but i change it and a friend of mine tested all the audio components and they were all fine (from hardware point of view).
So maybe the audio problem is related to the board itself.
Here you can find some pics of the board itself and in particular of the audio part of the cpu board...
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/819/3ywx.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/819/3ywx.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/850/3ksz.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/850/3ksz.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/593/ir.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/593/ir.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/341/glpx.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/341/glpx.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/195/1g1l.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/195/1g1l.jpg/)
Could you tell me what you think about it?
I've to buy another board or the board can just be repaired (in case do you know from who)?
Please help me finally restoring my power drift cab.
;D
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Let me state the obvious :): did you check the 5V juicing your PCB? The board blocking problems you are experiencing sound very "5V too low or too high" to me. Are 12V juicing your board correctly? They are related to audio, so if they are missing, audio will be missing too.
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Let me state the obvious :): did you check the 5V juicing your PCB? The board blocking problems you are experiencing sound very "5V too low or too high" to me. Are 12V juicing your board correctly? They are related to audio, so if they are missing, audio will be missing too.
I just check, but trust me i don't know where the +5v or +12v comes out.... ???
I have a psu inside the cab but only have +V and -V.......
And i don't know what is mean......
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check the manual for the filter pinout diagram
there's 2 connectors on the left end (one for each level of the pcb) with lots of yellow and white cables, they are power. +5v & ground (i think the 5v is the white, to be checked)
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check the manual for the filter pinout diagram
there's 2 connectors on the left end (one for each level of the pcb) with lots of yellow and white cables, they are power. +5v & ground (i think the 5v is the white, to be checked)
Thank you.
I'll try to have the measurements just by those points.....
But what does mean the fact i have +V and -V on the PSU??
Here you can find two pics of the PSU:
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/819/18f2.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/819/18f2.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/203/o7c2.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/203/o7c2.jpg/)
Where are the +12v and +5v??
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Take a look at this: http://pcbiroiro.blogspot.it/2012/03/one-of-my-favourite-games-and-that-of.html
yellow 5V, white ground. Being the cables connected to your PSU white and yellow, i suppose they are 5V and GND. Take your multimeter and measure it to be sure.
About the audio: that board have not a built-in amplifier, but an external one. To see which one is defective, the amp or the audio output on the board, you should listen to the non amplified audio coming from the board by using a ear-phone (see previous link for reference).
It could help to see some other pic of the internal part of the cabinet
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Take a look at this: http://pcbiroiro.blogspot.it/2012/03/one-of-my-favourite-games-and-that-of.html
yellow 5V, white ground. Being the cables connected to your PSU white and yellow, i suppose they are 5V and GND. Take your multimeter and measure it to be sure.
About the audio: that board have not a built-in amplifier, but an external one. To see which one is defective, the amp or the audio output on the board, you should listen to the non amplified audio coming from the board by using a ear-phone (see previous link for reference).
It could help to see some other pic of the internal part of the cabinet
I've to check the voltage on the board but in the meantime i do the following tests....
I change the z80 on the board but nothing change.
I use a connector to use ear-phone via pcb directly, but i cannot see the audio.
If i disconnect the audio cable from the pcb, i cannot hear anything from the speakers even if i put volume to max.
Below are some pics of the internal:
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/853/m9sa.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/853/m9sa.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/268/2gkz.JPG) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/268/2gkz.JPG/)
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/844/p5mu.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/844/p5mu.jpg/)
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I don't mean to be offensive but based on your postings here I guess that you are new to pcb/electronics repair?
You have three options:
1 - Go on like you are doing and hopefully you get lucky.... But most likely you will do more damage then good :? And kill the pcb.
2 - Find somebody who is willing to service the board for you. You ask around on this forum.
3 - Decide it is time for a carreer change in which case I recomment that you use the internet to get yourself up to speed in electronics and then try to fix your pcb.
I hope you see this as a first positive step towards a working pcb. 8)
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I don't mean to be offensive but based on your postings here I guess that you are new to pcb/electronics repair?
You have three options:
1 - Go on like you are doing and hopefully you get lucky.... But most likely you will do more damage then good :? And kill the pcb.
2 - Find somebody who is willing to service the board for you. You ask around on this forum.
3 - Decide it is time for a carreer change in which case I recomment that you use the internet to get yourself up to speed in electronics and then try to fix your pcb.
I hope you see this as a first positive step towards a working pcb. 8)
Thank you for your suggestions but i already try to find someone that repair the board for me, but seems that nobody wants/have the necessary test bench to perform repair on those type of boards....
For this i already search for a replacement pcb but seems that they are not so easy to find......
If you have any other suggestion, i'll glady follow it.
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Sorry, but i am missing something here :)
- with the volume all the way up and everithing connected, is some audio (i mean, an audio hummm or interference, not necessarily a game sound/music) audible? If yes, your amp board is ok (it's the board with big aluminum heatsink on the upper right side on your pics) and considering that you said that with earphones and audio cable disconnected nothing comes from the PCB, i would suspect the audio section of the board to be defective
- can you please measure the voltage between the white and yellow cables from the PSU? Measure them directly on the PSU. If they are ok, measure them on the board (there should be some test point for that, try to find them). Your reset problems could be related to a not sufficient logic voltage (5V) to the board...
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I don't mean to be offensive but based on your postings here I guess that you are new to pcb/electronics repair?
You have three options:
1 - Go on like you are doing and hopefully you get lucky.... But most likely you will do more damage then good :? And kill the pcb.
2 - Find somebody who is willing to service the board for you. You ask around on this forum.
3 - Decide it is time for a carreer change in which case I recomment that you use the internet to get yourself up to speed in electronics and then try to fix your pcb.
I hope you see this as a first positive step towards a working pcb. 8)
Thank you for your suggestions but i already try to find someone that repair the board for me, but seems that nobody wants/have the necessary test bench to perform repair on those type of boards....
For this i already search for a replacement pcb but seems that they are not so easy to find......
If you have any other suggestion, i'll glady follow it.
Ok guys, who is going to italy this summer.......... Speak up :twisted:
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You should all come to Italy in summer: we have kilometers of coasts, mountains, the best food (and girls :D) in the world, great arts and monumental cities (Rome, Venice, Firenze... the nicest cities on the globe at only 3 and a half hours of train each other)... you know that there's not a better place ;)
AND
some nice private game room, like glstar's gameroom ;)
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I've been to Italy last year. And I never go to the same country twice in a row :)
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I've been to Italy last year. And I never go to the same country twice in a row :)
"Never say never": looks like it's time for an exception :D
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Sorry, but i am missing something here :)
- with the volume all the way up and everithing connected, is some audio (i mean, an audio hummm or interference, not necessarily a game sound/music) audible? If yes, your amp board is ok (it's the board with big aluminum heatsink on the upper right side on your pics) and considering that you said that with earphones and audio cable disconnected nothing comes from the PCB, i would suspect the audio section of the board to be defective
- can you please measure the voltage between the white and yellow cables from the PSU? Measure them directly on the PSU. If they are ok, measure them on the board (there should be some test point for that, try to find them). Your reset problems could be related to a not sufficient logic voltage (5V) to the board...
Hi.
Yes i can hear crackling and interference on the speakers with all connected....
I tried to make an earphone adapter to bypass the amp on the cabinet, but i can only hear some noise on the earphone.....like the same i hear on the speakers itself.
I measure the voltage and i got 5,40v on the psu and 5,20v on the board.
Plus i have the correct voltage on the amp too....
I also change the z80 that should control the audio in the pcb but that cannot changed anything.....
What else i could try to change?
I got a yamaha processor too to change in case, but since it's soldered i don't know if that could solve the problem or it's just a waste of time changing it.
I also bought another pcb, but it comes from the deluxe version of power drift, so i really don't know if i can change mine with this one (when it'll arrive to me).....
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Ok, i would suspect a PCB problem, audio circuit. If you hear noise from the speakers the amp should not be defective (even if those SEGA indeed ARE "thin").
5.20V are on the high side: turn the value down to 5.00V on the board.
Eventually, check for broken traces on the audio section of the board, "bad looking" components, bad connections, ground ...
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Ok, i would suspect a PCB problem, audio circuit. If you hear noise from the speakers the amp should not be defective (even if those SEGA indeed ARE "thin").
5.20V are on the high side: turn the value down to 5.00V on the board.
Eventually, check for broken traces on the audio section of the board, "bad looking" components, bad connections, ground ...
I'll do about the adjustment in the psu.
Visually speaking there's nothing wrong into the board.....
Yesterday i also tried to mount the yamaha chip, but nothing change....
Could be some sega customs??
Yesterday the new board has been shipped out.....
Shame the board if from a deluxe unit....
Could i mount it or i risk to damage it??
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Seems a pcb problem unfortunatly :s Hopefully it is "only" the sound. I've a unworking power drift pcb (cpu board is defective), really need to investigate it some day...
btw i go to italy for summer vacation , Ficulle to be accurate :p
anyway gud luck in your pcb repair
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Seems a pcb problem unfortunatly :s Hopefully it is "only" the sound. I've a unworking power drift pcb (cpu board is defective), really need to investigate it some day...
btw i go to italy for summer vacation , Ficulle to be accurate :p
Yes...
Seems only the audio the problem (if you can call it "only"......)....
I'm trying to obtain a working upright board, but i can't find it..... :'(
Very good choice....
Umbria is really a beautiful place.....
Just like many parts of Italy...
Just like Rome....
But only for holidays....not for living....
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actually, i've 2 power drift cab. One Euro like yours and one with Grey side (look like a usa/jap version).
the euro one is working (got it from level42, thanks again). I spend some time to swap boards, EPROM,... wihtout luck, the cpu board is dead
without diagram, your best bet is to trace from the audio ouput and verify all the chip and check the analog signal with a oscilloscope.
checking on gamoover a deluxe pcb , looks exactly the same than the upright. There's a small daughter board (sound), but this is the early version of the pcb, which got replaced by maskrom on the cpu board (i got 1 pcb like yours and 1 like this one)
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20121215150934-eyeshield%2071-IMG-1818-1-.JPG)
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actually, i've 2 power drift cab. One Euro like yours and one with Grey side (look like a usa/jap version).
the euro one is working (got it from level42, thanks again). I spend some time to swap boards, EPROM,... wihtout luck, the cpu board is dead
without diagram, your best bet is to trace from the audio ouput and verify all the chip and check the analog signal with a oscilloscope.
checking on gamoover a deluxe pcb , looks exactly the same than the upright. There's a small daughter board (sound), but this is the early version of the pcb, which got replaced by maskrom on the cpu board (i got 1 pcb like yours and 1 like this one)
(http://gamoovernet.pixhotel.fr/pics_gamoovernet690px/20121215150934-eyeshield%2071-IMG-1818-1-.JPG)
Yes....
The board i'm waiting for i exactly the same you posted here....
From your experience, it could be possible to attach it directly into my upright or i could fry the board??
I can't understand if that deluxe pcb has different pinout than the uprights one???
And in case i cannot use it directly into the cab, could i swap the sound eeproms between upright board and deluxe board?
I understand that i need to use an oscilloscope, but that's for sure not a job for me.....
Maybe i can send the board to you.
:)
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The board i'm waiting for i exactly the same you posted here....
From your experience, it could be possible to attach it directly into my upright or i could fry the board??
this is the board i had from my second upright, and the connection are exactly the same. If you look at the PD upright manual, you'd see that there dipswitches for setting the cab type (moving deluxe,upright,mini upright,mo use). So you're safe to plugin your deluxe pcb to your cab.
And in case i cannot use it directly into the cab, could i swap the sound eeproms between upright board and deluxe board?
you'll have to put the sound daughter board from your deluxe to your rev.2 defective board by removing the sound mask rom from the cpu board
Maybe i can send the board to you.
Sorry, i already lack time to fix my own cabs & pcb, so i can not ( and i lack the skills). But if your deluxe pcb is working, if you ever sale your defective one , i'd interested
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The board i'm waiting for i exactly the same you posted here....
From your experience, it could be possible to attach it directly into my upright or i could fry the board??
this is the board i had from my second upright, and the connection are exactly the same. If you look at the PD upright manual, you'd see that there dipswitches for setting the cab type (moving deluxe,upright,mini upright,mo use). So you're safe to plugin your deluxe pcb to your cab.
And in case i cannot use it directly into the cab, could i swap the sound eeproms between upright board and deluxe board?
you'll have to put the sound daughter board from your deluxe to rev.2 defective board.
Maybe i can send the board to you.
Sorry, i already lack time to fix my own cabs & pcb, so i can not. But if your deluxe pcb is working, if you ever sale your defective one , i'd interested
Thank you for letting me know.
So i've to check when i receive the new board....
P.S.:What do you mwan by sway the daughter board??
Mine upright pcb already have sound roms into, so it's not only a roms swap??
I have to put all the daughter board completely?
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i'm aware of 2 pcb revision.
rev1. : if you look closely to the deluxe pcb, you'd see a "3 level" with a small daugther board with 4 eproms. this is the sound eproms board.
rev2. : sega totaly remove that 3rd level "small daugther board" by merging those 4 eproms into 1 maskrom directly on the cpu board.
your best bet is really to wait for the new board
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to whate i'm aware of there's 2 revision of the pcb.
rev1. : if you look closely to the deluxe pcb, you'd see a "3 level" with a small daugther board with 4 eproms. this is the sound eproms board.
rev2. : sega totaly remove that 3rd level "small daugther board" by merging those 4 eproms into 1 maskrom directly on the cpu board.
Ok so since i have a rev2 into my upright and a rev1 incoming, if i want to use rev1 sound roms i've to detach them from that board and insert them into the rev2, right?
No use for the daughter board into the rev2 pcb, right?
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Ok so since i have a rev2 into my upright and a rev1 incoming, if i want to use rev1 sound roms i've to detach them from that board and insert them into the rev2, right?
no, you've to detach the whole sound daughter board from rev1 , remove the maskrom from rev2 and plug the sound daughter board in your rev2 (the board plug in the maskrom socket)
No use for the daughter board into the rev2 pcb, right?
the only use of doing that, would be to test if the maskrom on rev2. is bad or not. i did that test with my 2 pcbs ;)
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Ok so since i have a rev2 into my upright and a rev1 incoming, if i want to use rev1 sound roms i've to detach them from that board and insert them into the rev2, right?
no, you've to detach the whole sound daughter board from rev1 , remove the maskrom from rev2 and plug the sound daughter board in your rev2 (the board plug in the maskrom socket)
No use for the daughter board into the rev2 pcb, right?
the only use of doing that, would be to test if the maskrom on rev2. is bad or not. i did that test with my 2 pcbs ;)
Thank you for all your information.....
Now i only have to wait for the new board to come........
I really hope to have finally the cab up and running soon....
:)
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Power Drift is a great underestimate game.
wish you get yours up and running.
btw do you have a scan of the sides ? :-)
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Power Drift is a great underestimate game.
wish you get yours up and running.
btw do you have a scan of the sides ? :-)
Yes.
I don't want to be blasphemous but i think that it's more fun than mine outrun deluxe....(apart from the moving machine of course)....
I spent alot of time restoring it and alot of money buying parts for it (a new monitor, new control panel, new sidearts ecc....).....
I only have the arts i applyed....
I don't know how to get some scan of them....
Some high res pictures of them could help?
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Power Drift is a great underestimate game.
wish you get yours up and running.
btw do you have a scan of the sides ? :-)
Yes.
I don't want to be blasphemous but i think that it's more fun than mine outrun deluxe....(apart from the moving machine of course)....
I spent alot of time restoring it and alot of money buying parts for it (a new monitor, new control panel, new sidearts ecc....).....
I only have the arts i applyed....
I don't know how to get some scan of them....
Some high res pictures of them could help?
for scanning, you'd need a special flat bed scanner, but already an hi res scan would be enought thanks !
you got your parts from ebay ?
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Power Drift is a great underestimate game.
wish you get yours up and running.
btw do you have a scan of the sides ? :-)
Yes.
I don't want to be blasphemous but i think that it's more fun than mine outrun deluxe....(apart from the moving machine of course)....
I spent alot of time restoring it and alot of money buying parts for it (a new monitor, new control panel, new sidearts ecc....).....
I only have the arts i applyed....
I don't know how to get some scan of them....
Some high res pictures of them could help?
for scanning, you'd need a special flat bed scanner, but already an hi res scan would be enought thanks !
you got your parts from ebay ?
I'll see what i can do...
I got all from Stephen at arcadefixit.
Only him can help in find those rarity....
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Ok so since i have a rev2 into my upright and a rev1 incoming, if i want to use rev1 sound roms i've to detach them from that board and insert them into the rev2, right?
no, you've to detach the whole sound daughter board from rev1 , remove the maskrom from rev2 and plug the sound daughter board in your rev2 (the board plug in the maskrom socket)
No use for the daughter board into the rev2 pcb, right?
the only use of doing that, would be to test if the maskrom on rev2. is bad or not. i did that test with my 2 pcbs ;)
Yesterday i've received the "new" board....
Event this has some problems.... :-[
First the graphics is bad and i discovered later that one of the pin of the video connector has broken, so hopefully is a simple fix.
The audio instead is always a problem.....
This time i can hear something, but it's always the same sound....always the same even in test menu....
View My Video (http://tinypic.com/r/n5j69h/5)
I already tried to change some eeproms from both boards just to see if i can understand what the problem could be, but until now i've the same problems with all the chips i've change....
You can see all the chip i swap from board to another, circled in green:
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/834/ht6j.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/834/ht6j.jpg/)
I also tried to swap the daugther board with the maskrom from my old cpu board but i always got those strange sound....
I also tried to use the daughter board into my old cpu board (the one with no sound at all) and i've no sound...so nothing change....
Could you please give me a shot of your cpu board?
Because both my boards are exactly the same (apart for the audio daughter board of course), but with only a difference....
The eeproms epr-11755 and epr-11756 were inverted in my new board (the ones circled in red), so i don't know what of two combinations is right.
(http://imageshack.us/scaled/thumb/834/ht6j.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/834/ht6j.jpg/)
What else i could try??
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There are various versions of that board, so the first thing to do should be find out which versions you have. You need an eprom programmer for that. If your version was not dumped and you have a defective ROM there are no ways to solve the prob (at least untill a working board is dumped).
Those swapped roms are, bet it, two out of three sample roms (check the following mame code). There are four sound roms in that PCB: three eproms (those with the quartz window) and a mask rom (no window).
ROM_REGION( 0x10000, "soundcpu", 0 ) // Z80 sound CPU
1696 ROM_LOAD( "epr-11899.102", 0x000000, 0x10000, CRC(ed9fa889) SHA1(25d1a069254b34c31d8ee82d301ada895e8dc391) )
1697
1698 ROM_REGION( 0x200000, "pcm", ROMREGION_ERASEFF ) // SegaPCM samples
1699 ROM_LOAD( "mpr-11754.107", 0x000000, 0x80000, CRC(ebeb8484) SHA1(269f33cb1a9be126bada858e25291385d48686a2) )
1700 ROM_LOAD( "epr-11756.105", 0x080000, 0x20000, CRC(12e43f8a) SHA1(0f9a11ba6b7c1a352daa1146a01ce147945e91e4) )
1701 ROM_RELOAD( 0x0a0000, 0x20000 )
1702 ROM_RELOAD( 0x0c0000, 0x20000 )
1703 ROM_RELOAD( 0x0e0000, 0x20000 )
1704 ROM_LOAD( "epr-11755.106", 0x100000, 0x20000, CRC(c2db1244) SHA1(c98fe17c9f04a639a862cc2a86fab17d1f5d025c) )
1705 ROM_RELOAD( 0x120000, 0x20000 )
1706 ROM_RELOAD( 0x140000, 0x20000 )
1707 ROM_RELOAD( 0x160000, 0x20000 )
You can eventually swap the two eprom you cited before (epr-11756 and 11755): no risks at all being the same chip (27C1000 right? I cannot read on your pics...). Anyhow, the right order should be 11755 on the left, 11756 on the right.
With the eprom programmer you could also check the sample eproms to be bad or good ... i can eventually do it for you if there are no arcade lovers in Rome ready to help you ;)
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Power Drift is a great underestimate game.
wish you get yours up and running.
btw do you have a scan of the sides ? :-)
Yes.
I don't want to be blasphemous but i think that it's more fun than mine outrun deluxe....(apart from the moving machine of course)....
I spent alot of time restoring it and alot of money buying parts for it (a new monitor, new control panel, new sidearts ecc....).....
I only have the arts i applyed....
I don't know how to get some scan of them....
Some high res pictures of them could help?
for scanning, you'd need a special flat bed scanner, but already an hi res scan would be enought thanks !
you got your parts from ebay ?
I'll see what i can do...
I got all from Stephen at arcadefixit.
Only him can help in find those rarity....
Sorry to bring up a dead thread, but did anyone ever scan the side art or find reproduction art for Power Drift? I just bought a machine in great shape aside from some flaws in the side art.